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SJ 05-26-2006 12:23 PM

education y nuestra raza
 
Why are so many of us discouraged from learning? Why don't we enjoy gaining knowledge? Why aren't enough of us following through our education? The most important question, how do we change this. what can we do to improve this?

Is learning not enjoyable for the majority? what's the cause of this? Is society responsible for making it a chore? or is there something else I am missing?

The solution is reaching to those who don't want or think they can learn. Make them realize that learning can be enjoyable if you find the right subject. Easier said than done. how are we suppose to reach out to so many kids that don't think they can make it? Or worst, have no interest in making it.

I think the problems, starts at a very young age. School is introduced as a chore. It must be introduced as something beneficial. Struggling in school, due to difficult subject matter, discourages many. Education turns it into a chore. Education and gaining knowledge is no longer fun. Teachers are not well paid. Rooms are packed. It's hard for teachers to concentrate on the struggling students and encourage them. It's up to us to encourage them. But how?

Maybe parents are partly to blame. Perhaps they are responsible for introducing education as a chore. Homework is a good example, parents telling their kids to do their homework, interrupting their favorite games. Many parents don't spend the time explaining why. All the kid is aware of, is that their fun time was just ended because of their "dumb teacher and his/her stupid homework"

My mom took the time to explain it to me, maybe this is why my education is my main priority right now and why that's always been the case in my life. There was big encouragement in highschool. I belong to a program aimed for us, to guide us in the right educational paths. Without this, I wouldn't know the first thing about what the UC or state requirements were. The importance of the SAT's. the benefits to those 'difficult" ap courses, etc.

The people I hanged out with, were also a big part of that. I surrounded myself around people who cared about their education. It was difficult to slack off, when your friends took education seriously. We weren't nerds. We were just aware.

thoughts? I will write more about this later.

SuaveHighTimes 05-26-2006 12:30 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Nerd.

No seriously, I get your meaning. I can't trace what the reasoning for my stubbornness to excel was. I won't blame my parents because blaming others as apposed to taking responsibility for my own actions would be untrue..

I do wish I would have graduated. In fact, had I tried I wouldn't have had a problem doing so.

As an adult, it's much harder to make time for an education. Yep, I still make excuses for myself.

SJ 05-26-2006 12:37 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
you've touched on another important factor. The responsibilities as an invididual to want to gain knowledge. But many of that is determined by how the world is painted for us by our parents or those around us at a very young age.

I am not saying we should blame our parents for everything. They hold a part of how we decide to view our education. But they are not completely responsible. I've seen parents on the other extreme where they give it their best to encourage education and the kid still doesn't "get it"

I will talk more about this when I get the chance.

Chunky Aztec 05-26-2006 12:44 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
I took education very seiously as a youngster, I even loved going to school lol (wierd i know). The problem began around my freshman year. Financial problems were the main problem to me. Not having enough money for anything made me start doing other things, and the downfall began.

I think alot of kids now a days do take school as a chore. Parents are also a big part, most don't push their kids as much as they need to. To me though it's mainly money. Most of my friends dropped out cause they had no choice, they needed to help out. In other words they thought that while an education would ensure good pay later, it brought them nothing at the time.

SuaveHighTimes 05-26-2006 12:45 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
I should really try to get my GED before the end of this year. Is the test hard? lol. This thread is inspiring.

Professora 05-26-2006 01:00 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
SJ, these are the questions of the ages for those of us who work in education! When I have more time, I will make some comments, but I just wanted to let you know for now that it's a great post!

_aztec_princess_ 05-26-2006 01:02 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
i heard the test is not hard.. ^^^ for suave

i enjoy learnin but its just on some subjects... i like goin to school.. some call me nerd but hell naw im not.. those who know me know knowledge coams naturally to me and im bad ass.. im no nerd i cant help it if my brainis better than theirs!!! lol the one thing i hate is homrok sometimes i dont do it i think school is enough!

SuaveHighTimes 05-26-2006 01:04 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
I suck at math. :-(

_aztec_princess_ 05-26-2006 01:11 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SuaveHighTimes
I suck at math. :-(

i odnt like amth but im pretty good at it..

tecpaocelotl 05-26-2006 01:21 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
My parents always encouraged me to learn technology as much as possible to adapt to modern times and situations (and also read the user manual every time we got a product. LOL.).

tecpaocelotl 05-26-2006 02:42 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SuaveHighTimes
I suck at math. :-(

I was pretty good. I taught my sister addition when she was 3 when I was 6. I taught her so much math that in the 4th grade, most of the work was done by her. Also, my Junior high homework also. LOL.

With that out of the way, I had more time to read and writing which I sucked until college. LOL.

FreedomNow 05-26-2006 02:44 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
this is a great thread...


my father put it in my head when i was in kindergarten that i was going to be an engineer... i had no idea what the hell an engineer was, but i would always reply when asked what i wanted to do when i grow up, AN ENGINEER!

i was always at the top of my classes but was always a little clown and shit talker. in high school i was bad... but i still was a top student... i would ditch smoke out in my first couple of years but still managed to do my thing in classes. i would not make the honor roll b/c i of my behavior... i never thought of college in high school... until a teacher made it very clear to me that she saw something special in me. that i had an ability to learn things very quickly and to elaborate on things...

my parents always wanted me to go to college... but i didnt realize i could and the benefits of it til senior yr when all my friends were working at taco bells and things like that... i thought to myself that i never wanted to work at a job like that... i didnt want people to tell me what to do...


i then went off to college... i started as a math major and wanted to teach high school math... my outlook changed after first yr and i became interested in history and learning y we were in the situations we r in as a people.


and now i work with kids tryin to stress the importance of being educated... being educated in a manner that allows them to think freely and critically about a wide range of issues. i encourage students to go as far as they can possibly go... i m really happy b/c next year will be the first year where the students i work with will be applying to colleges and graduating...

citlalin 05-26-2006 02:54 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Well, I have degrees in chemistry, molecular biology, english (tech writing), and I'm earning my final degree in rhetoric and professional communication. I come from a poor migrant laborer family and nothing has ever been easy for me. If I can do it, so can they. So, there really is no excuse for our people to lack a basic university level education.

Right now, my earning potential is 75K/year (my current job). When I finish my PhD, I'm marketable anywhere from 100K/year down to 36K/year, depending on which job I choose (most likely the high-paying job).

I agree with a lot that has been said in this thread. Mostly, I believe it is the doping effects of an Amerikkkan lifestyle and Amerikkkan media that distracts our youth from becoming educated. If our youth can learn to ignore these doping effects and focus on serious study, only then can they strive to the next level and become educated. But it's not going to happen with a TV-set mind and mentality.

Mexican Mami 05-26-2006 03:14 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
To be honest, I've always disliked school. I had a really rough time as a kid because we lived in a really bad neighborhood with the worst teachers and the worst education. I've always felt that the teachers at my schools were always mean and it almost felt like they were forced to be there (except for a few). My parents were never able to help me with schoolwork because they never had an education themselves and didn't speak English. So school has always been a challenge for me. Not until I started attending Jr. College did I start enjoying it.

Now I believe education is not only a neccessity but critical in the advancement of our people and children. I try to make learning exciting for my neices and nephews and I also stress the importance of education for their future.

So, for me, there were many contributing factors why I disliked school and I'm just happy I "saw the light" before it was too late.

SuaveHighTimes 05-26-2006 03:26 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
I don't think my parents ever even talked about college to us. My dad would rather I find a part time job then get an A in class, and they actually encouraged me to STOP READING! Apparently, I spent to much on books! But reading has always been my thing. Never that pops, never that.

School to my folks was just a way of getting someone to watch us while they were out working.

But I don't blame them. They came from a Rancho that didn't hav any schools. The didn't know any better.

Nevertheless, dey gots a bright kid in me, and i does dem proud.

FreedomNow 05-26-2006 03:26 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by citlalin
Well, I have degrees in chemistry, molecular biology, english (tech writing), and I'm earning my final degree in rhetoric and professional communication. I come from a poor migrant laborer family and nothing has ever been easy for me. If I can do it, so can they. So, there really is no excuse for our people to lack a basic university level education.

Right now, my earning potential is 75K/year (my current job). When I finish my PhD, I'm marketable anywhere from 100K/year down to 36K/year, depending on which job I choose (most likely the high-paying job).

I agree with a lot that has been said in this thread. Mostly, I believe it is the doping effects of an Amerikkkan lifestyle and Amerikkkan media that distracts our youth from becoming educated. If our youth can learn to ignore these doping effects and focus on serious study, only then can they strive to the next level and become educated. But it's not going to happen with a TV-set mind and mentality.


those degrees r impressive... reminds me of some lyrics....

WE NEED MASTERS IN BIOLOGY, ZOOLOGY TO OVERTAKE ILLUMINATI TRICKNOLOGY!


at the same time i feel that we need to teach our youth to be able to educate themselves and not believe everything that is fed to them in the university... we have to create our own educational paradigms or else we will be stuck in the same trap for a long ass time...

Cathreina 05-26-2006 03:45 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SuaveHighTimes
I should really try to get my GED before the end of this year. Is the test hard? lol. This thread is inspiring.

Yes Suave you should. Use that same determination/ganas, that you use in getting a cell phone and in your ebay business to further your education. I'm sure there are many of us who believe in you and that you can reach your goal. Also, there are many students and grads in here that I'm sure will help you along. How about it Suarve. I challenge you.

Nelio 05-26-2006 07:00 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
I am not finished reading the whole thread yet. But here are my thoughts about why it is hard TODAY. The way i see it, the kids think it is hard and get burned out. I think a major reason is because school is mostly based on "TEST" now and learning the "test". Not learning the actual work or why it is important. All they know or care about is passing the test to move on. Because that is what the school is telling them. T he parents push the kids to do good on the test because they think that them doing good on the test will get them moved on further. Not knowing that they are missign out on alot of education, possibly because they do not ask or know that the contents of the test arent really teachign the kids all that much.

Now that is just the way i see it.

My friends son, he just passed kindergarden i believe. To pass he had to know his numbers up to 100. A TEST ALREADY!!! Now i do think education is important, i think it is more important then test are. Test never define how much one truley knows.

I think people also, society as well, make to much a big deal about going to SCHOLASTIC institutions. Higher learning is good, i know that. But there are other schools out there besided SCHOLASTIC schools. Such as trade schools and tech schools. They are just as good as any university. But you alwyas hear about GO TO A UNIVERSITY, GO THERE, it will get you a good job. That is not always the case. Besides that, to much a big thing is made on making money. You need a college education to make big money. But that is not true. Besides that why be greedy anyways. Why iss the only reason you are going to school is to make lots of money?

zapatasbloodjv 05-26-2006 08:24 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
i think the problem is most chicanos have thier roots in the rural areas of mexico and its spanish colonial legacy. the spanish and the criollos who run mexico now have no need for indios and/or "mestizos" getting educated. so many our our forefathers saw no future in books or numbers. after elementary education school in mexico costs $$$, so parents generally push thier children to work. this mind frame is present in the chicano community today.

this is in contrast to say the chinese community that holds education is the key for social and economic mobility push thier children to succeed in school. the parents slave away for long hrs and invest all thier savings into the college educations of thier kids. because in china, the even the poor could get high level jobs in all sector of society if they were smart enough.
chicano parents, on the other hand, push thier kids to low-skilled, low-wage jobs so that they can help out the family. because in mexico, ur skin color was a barrier as well as economic standing.

the difference is in thinking in the short-term vs. the long term, and in coming from countries where education is a means of mobility vs. one where education is a dead end.

Cathreina 05-26-2006 09:01 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

My friends son, he just passed kindergarden i believe. To pass he had to know his numbers up to 100. A TEST ALREADY!!! Now i do think education is important, i think it is more important then test are. Test never define how much one truley knows.
I feel that tests are needed to determine whether or not the studen themselves are grasping what is being taught. It defines the student who may be well advanced who can possibly be moved on into a more advanced class to the student who is having a bit of trouble and who may need special attention. And actually thosse just learning to count to a hundred in kindergarden are already behind because in this day and age, this is already being taught in pre-school to 4 yr olds.

Quote:

I think people also, society as well, make to much a big deal about going to SCHOLASTIC institutions. Higher learning is good, i know that. But there are other schools out there besided SCHOLASTIC schools. Such as trade schools and tech schools. They are just as good as any university. But you alwyas hear about GO TO A UNIVERSITY, GO THERE, it will get you a good job. That is not always the case. Besides that, to much a big thing is made on making money. You need a college education to make big money. But that is not true. Besides that why be greedy anyways. Why iss the only reason you are going to school is to make lots of money?
I believe this is up to an individual and just how far they want to expand their education. Nohting wrong with a trade/tech school, but lets say for instance a master carpenter after graduating wants to start his/her own business or take over a business. Sure some may say they will hire someone to take care of the administrative end, but I've seen many people lose everything they had because they did not have the administrative education to see that the one they hired didn't rob them blind or run their business into the gutter. I don't see additional education as a way to only get the big bucks, but a way to stay competitve in the career world.

Professora 05-26-2006 10:46 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
I've enjoyed reading everyone's posts!

As some others mentioned, I also learned a great deal from my parents at home before beginning my formal education. They taught me to read and write, work math problems, and took everyday activities as learning opportunities for me. My parents each went to community college for a while, but admit they were not intentional in their education. My mom went because she was waiting for my dad to get a full-time job so they could marry, and my dad enrolled because he was required to be in school for an internship program at a company. Neither of them completed an AA, but in their day, you really didn't need college to secure lucrative employment.

However, my parents could see the writing on the wall for the future, and they never gave me a choice about college--I was going one day, and that was final. In grade school, I was at least familiar with college as "the thing that comes after high school and helps people get good jobs." :) My parents didn't understand the academic requirements for the university, but they did understand that it was going to cost a lot of money. We made a deal when I was in about 6th grade--if I stayed out of trouble, and could get myself accepted to a university, they would make sure I had a way to go. I became the first person on either side of the family to attend a university, and later, the first to earn a bachelor's degree, and after that, the first to attend graduate school (my little sister went on to earn a BA, a teaching credential, and is currently in a graduate program, herself--I'm SO proud of her!). As I've mentioned to a few on Soy, I'm currently working on a PhD in Education.

With regard to some of the access and achievement motivation issues mentioned in this thread, to be honest, I really hated the entire K-16 process (kindergarten through the bachelor's degree). I had fun in school, and I earned good grades, but I didn't like the fact that so much of my day was dedicated to rote memorization--even in college. Someone mentioned "teaching to the test," which is so prevalent now because of legislation like No Child Left Behind. I argue that this has been going on in schools forever. It wasn't until graduate school that I really felt "free" in my learning. It helps that my department is VERY progressive, as well as supportive of the students, and I love that I have so many faculty members of color who really do care about improving the conditions of marginalized communities.

Zapatasbloodjv made a good point about how the Asian community views education as the key to upward mobility. I've done some work on Asians in the UC system (University of California for those not familiar), and for the most part, Asians work the system to their advantage in order to get ahead. They see a college education (especially from a prestigious school) as the ticket to success. I'm not suggesting that Chicanos operate in exactly the same way, but it is an interesting area to look at. There is literature that suggests that Latinos DO VALUE college attendance, but there is a significant GAP between holding that value, and making it a reality for our people. The gap is caused by lack of information, lack of financial resources, etc. These are some of the issues that need more attention if we are to ever achieve something even close to parity for Chicanos/Latinos in higher education.

MZBROWNEYES 05-26-2006 10:51 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Woohoo I Went Back To Skool When I Was 20 To Get My Diploma But Late Than Never Que No...

Professora 05-26-2006 10:58 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Nelio

I think people also, society as well, make to much a big deal about going to SCHOLASTIC institutions. Higher learning is good, i know that. But there are other schools out there besided SCHOLASTIC schools. Such as trade schools and tech schools. They are just as good as any university. But you alwyas hear about GO TO A UNIVERSITY, GO THERE, it will get you a good job. That is not always the case.

With regard to trade schools being "just as good as any university," it all depends on the industry a person is working in. For example, if want to be a master carpenter, you obviously would fare better going to a trade school than a traditional 4-year university. However, a trade school education might not be what an employer is looking for in other industries. Either way, you are correct--neither one can guarantee a huge paycheck. Much of that depends on the individual, or who a person knows, but that's an entirely different conversation.

Unfortunately, most Chicano students in high school and community college are not given the "go to a university" message. Our people are systematically TRACKED into vocational pathways, either via trade schools or community colleges. I don't mind people going to trade schools, as long as they are being presented with all the postsecondary educational options first. It's not fair when counselors and instructors simply put our students on this path due to their own prejudice, etc.

Professora 05-26-2006 11:01 PM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MZBROWNEYES
Woohoo I Went Back To Skool When I Was 20 To Get My Diploma But Late Than Never Que No...

That's awesome! :cheers:

It's never too late for education.

xicanachick 05-27-2006 03:08 AM

Re: education y nuestra raza
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Professora
Unfortunately, most Chicano students in high school and community college are not given the "go to a university" message. Our people are systematically TRACKED into vocational pathways, either via trade schools or community colleges. I don't mind people going to trade schools, as long as they are being presented with all the postsecondary educational options first. It's not fair when counselors and instructors simply put our students on this path due to their own prejudice, etc.


I totally agree with you Professora. When I was in high school (which actually was like...last year, lol) I had a lot of Chicano friends that spent the majority of their days at the Regional Occupational Program in my county. Their teachers or advisors told them to sign up for the program because most of them hadn't even thought about going to school after high school, so they figured they could just get them ready to enter the workforce. I remember that when I was junior, I asked my counselor if I could go, because it sounded like it could give you a head start on entering the medical field by preparing you to be a nurse practitionist. Thankfully, my counselor was Chicano himself, and flat out told me no. He knew what classes I was taking, my potential, and said that if anything, the program would hinder my future. Thanks to his help throughout my fours years in high school, I graduated with Honors in the top 5% of my class, and am lucky enough to be attending UCLA while pursuing a Physiological Science Bachelors of Science. Higher education is MOST DEFINITELY an available option for any student of any race, socio-economic status or whatever. Of course, like it's been mentioned, post-secondary education is expensive, but there is help! I am here solely on financial aid, and of course it can be a little difficult financially sometimes, since you depend completely on the university for your money, but it's totally possible. Just remember...

SI SE PUEDE!!!!! :D


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